Divisive Battle Over Elián González Reverberates on a Miami Stage
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in TheaterSam Wilde on bringing The Fir Tree to Shakespeare’s Globe
Sam Wilde is an amazing designer, renowned for creating incredible, imaginative theatre designs and puppets out of simple bits of cardboard. From achieving a global internet sensation with his puppet show of Jon Klassen’s Hat Back books in lockdown, to a run of sellout live shows making the same stories bigger and better, he has been involved in some very exciting projects in the last couple of years. This winter he’s elevating his work still further, now gracing the boards of Shakespeare’s Globe in their festive family fairy tale The Fir Tree. We asked The Card-Bard about what he’ll be unboxing for us this Christmas in the glorious wooden O.
Sam, it really has been a great few years for you (give or take a global pandemic): your online productions of the Hat Back books went viral, then the live show was a complete sell out at the Little Angel Theatre. What does it feel like to now have your cardboard craft starring at the world famous Shakespeare’s Globe?
It certainly looks impressive when you give me an introduction like that! If you ask my daughter what I do for a living though she’ll tell you that her daddy “plays with cardboard”: that feels a little closer to the truth to me!
But I have certainly been very lucky, and there are a lot of fantastic collaborators who are as responsible for that as I am, fantastic creatives like Ian Nicholson (who directed The Hat Trilogy) and Jim Whitcher (who did the music) just to start with. I always say that there are no talented people in theatre, just talented teams, and I’ve been very fortunate with the teams I’ve been in! The Fir Tree is another great example of that, it’s a world-beating group of creatives that I’m just happy to be in the same room as!
None of that prepares you, though, for when you somehow find yourself in a position where you are suggesting to the Globe’s Artistic Director Michelle Terry (!!!) that you want to cut up some delivery boxes and put them on the Christmas stage of what is undoubtedly the world’s most important theatre! If the idea of that doesn’t terrify you then I want a little of what you have!
This version of The Fir Tree is an adaptation of the Hans Christian Andersen classic, by the incredible Hannah Khalil, writer in residence at the Globe. How has it been working with her and all those Shakespearean types? Is it very highbrow?
Hannah is great! I’ve been lucky enough to work with her on a couple of projects (and even luckier to have a couple more hopefully in the works) and I’d be hard pressed to think of a better, more generous collaborator. The scariest thing about working with Hannah is how astute and intuitive her daughter is! She’ll come into rehearsals or a dress rehearsal sometimes and that’s when I really get nervous, she’ll instantly see into the core of whatever the piece is! It’s uncanny!
As for highbrow, I don’t really know about that, it’s certainly a piece with artistic integrity, but it doesn’t lack for warmth or joy either. I remember my first meeting with Michelle (Terry) where she said she wanted to make a show that felt like a hug: that really stuck with me (especially as it was a time where good hugs were in short supply). This year it feels slightly different, still a hug, but with more… truth… and hope… and kindness in it. It’s an incredible team at the Globe and the creative team on the production is an absolute dream. I can’t imagine this show could be made in a different theatre, without the staff of the Globe, without Props or Wardrobe or Production Management, without Hannah or Michelle. Each and every one of them are incredibly rich in those noblest of qualities, of truth, of hope and above all of kindness.
I’m a very lucky designer to get to work alongside them!
What kind of things have you created for the production? And are they all made of vellum and parchment, it being an Elizabethan-style theatre?
Ha, I’m afraid not, I have just come off doing the puppetry design for The Book Thief Musical with The Octagon in Bolton, and that was much more of a parchment-focused job!
With The Fir Tree though the story and the theatre might be old, but what Hannah and Michelle have done with it couldn’t be further from the past! It’s a very modern story that is really relevant and apt for our times!
In terms of the design, I’ve tried to focus on how sustainably it can be made, but also as a real celebration of wood! Whether that be the forest of trees that were used to make the Globe itself or the actual potted fir trees that are ever present in the show. There are also a lot of lovely costumes and puppets, many of them I made myself, but it’s been a real team effort (shout out to the wonderful Emma Hughes at the Globe!). There’s a whole range of cardboard makes; large bird wings, rabbit ears, birds, vans, Beatrice and Benedict the mice, Ophelia the cat and Iago the rat… and Death who makes a small appearance! All taking place under a starry cardboard sky and advertised with a poster which is developed from hand cut cardboard shapes!
It must be a fairly risky business using cardboard props in an outdoor theatre. Is there waterproofing involved?
Cardboard is a lot hardier than folk give it credit for! That being said, water is obviously a bit of an issue, so we do take steps in preparation.
The main focus for me, and the entire reason I like to work with cardboard, is that it’s all destined for the recycling bin in the end. Some people get upset when I tell them that, but I really revel in it, so many puppets or set or materials are made for a specific show, and when that show is over, they’re never used again, but as they’re made of foam or plastic they just sit on a shelf, unused, forever. Yes, cardboard puppets have an expiration date, but so do I, and that is a wonderful, wonderful thing!
But to answer your question, yes, there is waterproofing (and fireproofing) involved, which makes the material less recyclable in the end, so what we actually do is make the puppet from cardboard and then put another layer of cardboard on top, it’s this that is treated, which can then be removed when the time comes.
Tell us a bit more about how you’ve worked sustainability and recycling into the production.
Sustainability and recycling have been at the real core of this shows design, when you see it and what Hannah Khalil has written you can see that it really had to be that way. But even if it wasn’t a central theme it’s how all theatre should be made: it’s how everything should be made going forward. The Globe and the team there really get that and everything it means for a production.
The simplest way to look at it is that every single thing in this show is considered: do we already have that? is that something that the Globe already has in storage? And if not, do they have something similar or something we can make work (which is yes for most of the set, props, costume in the show)? If we need to get something new, why? And can we borrow it from somewhere? Can we source it locally second hand? How are we going to get it? Will we reuse it? Can we recycle it? What happens to it after the show? Is it really necessary to tell the story?
It’s a lengthy process, but in the end we have made a show that has a really minimal environmental impact, that is a celebration of what sustainable theatre can be, and of all the other shows that came before us and allowed us to use a chair or a chest or the fabric to make a dress or whatever. It’s probably what I’m most proud of in this production.
That, and cardboard: an awful lot of boxes get another life on the stage!
One of the signature things about your work in the past is that the audience has been encouraged to join in and get creative themselves, even – if not especially! – with your online show. Will there be opportunities for that at the Globe? What activities might we expect?
I am so happy you’ve said this! More than cardboard or sustainability or anything else that has changed in my work in the last few years, it’s this that I feel has defined my attitude and work as an artist! It’s absolutely at the core of what I want to do, opening the world of design and construction, of craft and of making, to the public.
And yes, there is plenty to get involved with in this show. The Globe themselves are running puppetry-making and crafting workshops that I’ve had a hand in developing, and there will be plenty of other things that you can access digitally and make at home. I’d love to bring particular attention to The Sparrows; we’d would love it if you can access the online video (featuring me!) that shows you how to make the sparrow puppets and bring them along to the show. They are all made of cardboard and everyday household materials, and we need your help to fill the forest with as many more creatures than humans as we can muster, so if you don’t fancy a sparrow then why not make a pair of rabbit ears, or deer antlers or a squirrel tail or whatever you fancy! It’s your creativity that will make this show great!
Many thanks to Sam for finding time to chat with us about this exciting project. Here’s hoping for not too much snow this season!
The Fir Tree is a family show and runs from 15-31 December at Shakespeare’s Globe You can book tickets or learn how to make your own woodland creatures to bring to the show at the Globe website here. More
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in TheaterEmma Burnell on Triggered
Earlier this year, Emma Burnell‘s Triggered sold out its run in the lovely Lion & Unicorn Theatre. It’s now about to start a second run in the equally delightful White Bear Theatre from 22 November. Although it might be too late to get tickets as this has now sold out too! (We recommend checking with the venue for returns.) But sold out or not, we still grabbed the chance to chat with Emma about the show, reviewing herself and selling out.
Diving straight in, tell us what audiences can expect from Triggered?
Triggered is about the fictional deselection of a Labour MP. So first and foremost, it’s a play about political processes and the people to whom they matter.
But in truth, it’s about the real human beings that get involved in politics. I tried to look at the question of deselections from every angle – without taking a view. When we showed it the first time in the summer, we had the head of Momentum (the pro-Corbyn organisation) in and the head of Labour to Win (the pro-Starmer group) who both enjoyed it and both thought it made their case!
We get a laugh out of the byzantine nature of the rulebook, but what I wanted to show is that people in politics at all levels are trying to do their best. There aren’t any bad guys in Triggered – just good people with different perspectives.
Triggered played a short run earlier this year in Lion & Unicorn, how did you feel went? Have you changed or revisited anything in the play for this second run?
It went really well. We had incredibly responsive audiences who seemed to really love it. It was so interesting talking to them afterward and hearing their responses to it. Everyone has a different theory about it! It is so funny when people tell me that I wrote it with one aim or another in mind – and they all contradict each other. But the joy is – they do want to talk about it afterwards. That makes me feel like we’ve really achieved something.
I believe you had some Labour MPs attend, did they have any feedback on how the play reflected life in the Labour party?
They said it was almost too real! One night we even had a Labour whip in at the same time as an MP who was in trouble with leadership and whips. Luckily none of them was Gavin Williamson and everything was fine. The Whip was laughing a lot at the scenes about the discipline so that was good.
They were actually kind enough to make a video of their reactions.
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It must be a fantastic feeling to have sold out your second run but does it also bring any additional nerves or pressure with it?
In some ways I think it makes it easier. Audiences are lovely and responsive and give the actors so much energy. So, when we play to a full house, I think it just helps us all bring just a little something extra. However, we do need to make sure that whatever size of audience we’re playing for, we give it everything. The cast are so brilliant, I know they could and would deliver to one man and a dog.
However many people are there though, the thing is that they have paid us their money to be there. That’s not something I take lightly in these times. As someone who has (and still does) reviewed, I know that an audience’s time is precious and valuable. We owe them the best show we can give them.
During a recent round of chaos in British politics, there was a tweet from James Graham which said Don’t any of you buggers call anything political I ever write again ‘implausible’. It made me wonder, how do you approach presenting a play that audiences can believe and respect in a time when we have such unprecedented political chaos?
It’s interesting with this play. My first play – No Cure For Love – was set in a world I know nothing about. And yet both characters are me. They’re an extension of an argument I have in my head about love and sex all the time.
Here this is totally my world. I have worked in politics for 20 years. But none of the characters are me at all. In fact, at times I disagree with all of them.
But I knew that we would have a lot of people coming who would be really really bothered by us getting details wrong. So I learned the rulebook backwards. I got someone who does sit on an NEC panel to look over the script to make sure we wouldn’t be jarring people out of the action with something unrealistic.
This is your second play, plus you’re also a journalist and theatre reviewer. How have you found this new role as playwright and director? Has it affected how you approach your own reviews now that you have had a full view behind the stage curtain?
I learned so much about directing from reviewing. So many night watching plays that either entranced me or left me cold or were even just a bit middling, I wasn’t just responding in the moment, but thinking deeply about why that was. And making sure I understood that well enough for myself that I could articulate it in a way that others could find helpful.
It is so much harder reviewing now. Because I know so much how it feels to be critiqued in that way. But I also know that I am not – eventually – doing anyone any favours if I am not honest. If I give a play a low score, then I always make sure that I say why in the review. What it was that didn’t work for me and why so that – if they want to – they can address it. I hate reviews that are just about the reviewer showing off and being catty and arch or even about them celebrating the theme of the piece rather than the theatre of it.
For me reviews serve two purposes: firstly helping a hard pressed audience find something that they might want to go and watch; secondly, championing a piece that has really moved me (to laughter, tears or thoughtfulness) and that I think deserves shouting about.
If something is not great, I feel a duty to that first audience to say so, but to the second to justify why I think so.
Will we see more of Triggered, two sold out runs would suggest there might be a bright future for this particular play? Do you have anything else in the pipeline at the moment that you can tell us about?
I mean obviously if a much larger theatre wanted to develop Triggered that would be great. I am extremely proud of it as a piece (*awaits reviews – GULP*). A lot of people on Twitter have also mentioned that they would love to see it in their town, and I think political theatre like Triggered is having a real moment so I think there’s an audience there. What I don’t have is a budget to tour a four actor show or a producer with the know how! I’m open to conversation though – as that would be the dream.
I am also already working on my next piece of theatre – a one-woman cabaret show loosely based on the Medusa myth. And if I don’t chicken out, the one woman is going to be me. On stage for real, acting and even bloody singing!
I am also – somewhat bizarrely – potentially working on a Hollywood film with a guy who used to be my music teacher and is now an Emmy nominated composer. As Ferris Bueller says – life comes at you pretty fast sometimes.
Finally, for a bit of fun as we touched on your journalism and reviewing background above. What question should we have asked you here but managed to miss out and if you’d kindly answer it for us too 😉
These have been great questions. I suppose the question I am asking myself as I type these answers late on Sunday night is how I fit it all in. Which I don’t really know the answer to yet.
I know that the question I get a lot from theatre friends is whether I want to be an MP. My political friends know from the state of my Twitter (I am exceptionally indiscreet about myself) that I never would.
The truth is I would be a terrible MP. I know lots of people who do it brilliantly and they are so dedicated – I hope that respect shows in the piece. But I like to flit from theatre to politics to journalism. I like to write about sex and love and my past and potentially my future and all of those things would make me very unlikely to get through a selection process or to put up with doing the same job for years and years.
Thanks so much to Emma for taking time to chat with us, you can follow her on Twitter and visit her website here.
Triggered plays at White Bear Theatre 22 – 26 November and has sold out it’s run. Look for our Everything Theatre review to follow. More
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in TheaterPsychonaut Theatre on bring Mums to Lion and Unicorn Theatre
There’s a reason we love the Lion and Unicorn Theatre so much, and why it is the venue that perhaps comes up fairly regularly in our interviews. It certainly isn’t because of their comfy seats! No, it’s because they provide a place for emerging artists to hone their skill and their shows.
Which is why when we heard about Psychonaut Theatre and their show Mums which will play at the venue in December, we didn’t hesitate to find some time to chat about the show and their company.
So we sat down (on comfy chairs) with company founder and Artistic Director Arielle Zilkha, and Mums directors, Lavinia Grippa and Karola Kosecka, to hear more about the play and why venues such as this are so vital to young emerging artists.
Let’s kick straight off with Mums and what’s it all about then?
KK: Mums is a collective meditation on the process of grieving. During the performance we try to create a safe space for both audience and performers to draw on their internal landscapes of connotations with this state, through the story of one family who suffered a tragedy which pushed them into a permanent cycle of grief.
An impulse that had led me to start thinking about the topic was a line that I found in one of my old diaries. It was saying: “I am grieving after my brother’s wellbeing” but the key point here is that my brother was never fully healthy, he has always suffered. How can I grieve over something that was never real? Something that had never happened? We try to unpack those questions but our performance is not at all an answer given to the audience. It’s rather an invitation to go through those questions individually but in connection with others.
Mums is inspired by a 1994 play by Jean-Luc Lagarce – not a name that is probably known to that many of us, what brought you to this play?
KK: At the beginning of our creative process, I proposed a few general topics to the other performers to see which one resonated with all of us. I wanted to observe if there was any subject that could be thrown into the room and wake up people’s imaginations, memories, dreams. I started the discussion with giving them four broad terms: longing, grieving, sex, exclusion. We started unpacking those words and each member of our group had a possibility to share. After a short time, it became clear that we were all strongly interested in exploring a state of grieving. I started to collect all the things that can bring a person to grieving. I believe that you can reach this state not only after going through somebody’s death but also after a break-up, losing mental stability, after a job that you no longer have, youth, friendship and many more.
I started looking for texts that are very much rooted in this weird, ghosted sense of living with grief but I kept in mind to search for a piece that would still have elements of non-fiction storytelling. And that is when I first thought of Jean-Luc Lagarce – French director, actor and theatre maker from the second half of the twentieth century.
And you say inspired by as opposed to based on, how much is the original text and how much is your original for this play?
KK: Yes, I never say that we are basing our performance on Lagarce’s play. What I believe we did is that we took his text as a base to build on. After I translated the French script and cut out some bits from it, we ended up using less than one quarter of the original drama. Moreover, we added plenty of multiform content that we created in the process of workshopping. Our piece is immersed in music written by Arielle, which she based on a Polish folk song that I sang at one of our first sessions, during an exercise of creating a soundscape to situations that happened in our lives and that are somehow connected to grief. Later I also added the Parable of the Prodigal Son which became an ending to our story – a confession of the Mother to her kids, her subtle but unbearably honest way of telling her children what a mother is going through when she loses a son. There is also a monologue that Eva’s character gives– it was written by her and it came from her own process of building a relationship with the character she is playing.
The common thread is one of grief and how we deal with it, have you or the performers brought personal experiences to the performance as a way of making it more personal?
LG: The subject of grief was decided as the base of our play from the beginning of our process, mainly because we have all experienced grief in some way. It was very clear from the beginning that we didn’t want to restrict the concept of grief to death: we wanted to see it more as the loss of something or the longing that will never be fulfilled, something which is heavily explored in Mums.
Our process for the play started by exploring this concept further, through workshops and exercises, finding what grief meant for each performer and what their bigger object of grief was. As a company when devising work, we begin our process from the ‘outside’, exploring themes broadly through diving into our personal experiences, and then moving ‘inside’- finding a frame to apply our findings to. The text of Jean-Luc Lagarce was a great fit for our work: a common subject of grief and yet five very clear, personal and different approaches towards it.
This is Psychonaut Theatre’s first production, is this a sign of what you intend to do with future works? Will we be seeing more European inspired works?
AZ: Definitely! Because we’re such an international group, it’s really important to us that our work authentically represents the diversity of our ensemble. And through that, we love to discover less well-known international texts that we can translate and adapt as a springboard for our own material. Text has never been the driving force of our work as a group or as individuals, but that’s not to say that it hasn’t underpinned our devising process, like in Mums. Our work tends to be less narrative focussed, and perhaps less of what British theatre audiences are used to. Part of our mission as a company is to introduce these audiences to a more experimental style of theatre, and challenge them to take risks with the theatre they choose to watch- like we take risks with the theatre we make.
Additionally, because we operate as a collective of artists, the style of our group work will change on a project-to-project basis, representative of the directing member’s practice: a piece led by me would have a different focus and style to one led by Karola. But, we are all part of Psychonaut, and therefore we are driven by the same core principles.
What was the thought process behind that company name, it certainly stands out!
AZ: Thank you! Well, a psychonaut is someone who uses hallucinogenic substances to explore their subconscious. And that’s basically the experience we want to give to audiences who come to our shows. As performance-makers in the 21st century, we place a lot of focus on theatre as a live art form, and how that liveness can create new and perhaps unexpected events for the audience. Our aim for Mums is for it to take the audience to a place of meditation around grieving, where they can totally immerse themselves in the thoughts, feelings and experiences that come with it.
How did you get involved with The Lion and Unicorn Theatre?
AZ: Mums is a piece we developed during our final term at university, in preparation for our graduate showcase. We’d built the company during our time on the course so everything would be ready for us to launch into the industry once we graduated. Mums received really positive feedback from all different age groups, so I didn’t hesitate to take the plunge and get it out there! The Lion and Unicorn Theatre really stood out for me as a venue for emerging artists and companies, where the work doesn’t have to tick a specific box, but rather artists are free to take risks and experiment however they wish to. I’m really thankful that they saw something in our company and invited us to be part of their curated programme!
With the play called Mums, we have to ask, are you inviting your mums along to see it in December?
LG: With our mums all from different countries, it will be tricky- but we’ll definitely film it for them! However, there are a few different reasons why we chose this title. The first one is because of the more common name for the flower Chrysanthemum that is usually put on the graves of loved ones.
Grief, and the burden of pain sometimes distances us from all of the characteristics that usually represent motherhood, such as looking out for others, putting oneself as second and putting others as a priority. When grief comes along, especially grief for one’s child, all of this can fail. For our mother in the play this is exactly what happened: to nurture her pain and her grief she stopped nurturing her children, which led to them all trying to nurture themselves. We started to see them all as possible motherly figures, especially my character, the Oldest, who takes on the duty to do what her mother, destroyed by her own grief, is no longer able to do.
What do you have planned for 2023 after this then?
AZ: Our main goal for 2023 is to focus on taking Mums to more audiences and build more relationships with venues, perhaps also exploring non-theatrical spaces where it can be performed. We’d love to secure a longer run in London and maybe even take it out of the capital. In addition to that I’m also producing the UK premiere of a piece by collective member Juraj Benko, made in collaboration with Nordisk Teater Laboratorium-Odin Teatret in Denmark. And I’m going to start thinking about our next project which we’ll likely start working on in 2024. So, a lot to look forward to.
Our thanks to the team at Psychonaut Theatre for chatting with us. Mums will play at Lion and Unicorn Theatre 6 – 10 December 2022. Further information and bookings can be found here.
(Photo credits: Christina Sarkisian, Sanna Hofker and Alex Forey) More
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